Success is being in my best energy everyday - Sam Harte

Can you grow a successful business without sacrificing your energy, your family, or the life you actually want to live?

In this episode, John is joined by Sam Harte, director of Harte Outdoor Lighting, for a walk through Wicklow as they explore what it means to work on yourself while growing a business. Sam shares how purpose, presence, the Leadership Hour, and focusing on his daily energy have helped him step away from the constant grind, think more strategically, and create more space for the things that matter most. They also discuss trust versus control, why we tend to push harder when things get difficult, building a stronger culture within a business, and how coaching and accountability can help you become a better leader.

Want to connect with Sam Harte and learn more about Harte Outdoor Lighting?

Connect with Sam on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sam-harte/

Explore Harte Outdoor Lighting: https://www.harteoutdoorlighting.ie/

Interested in joining our next Grounded Man Hike? Click here for more: https://www.derunation.com/TGM-Hike

00:01:12 — Meet Sam Harte

00:05:22 — Finding Purpose Beyond the Daily Grind

00:08:17 — Finding Growth in Hard Times

00:10:41 — Control vs Trust

00:14:24 — You Are Not Your Thoughts

00:16:41 — Finding Presence in Everyday Life

00:21:14 — The Leadership Hour

00:26:28 — Energy and Better Results

00:27:53 — Working On the Business, Not In It

00:31:50 — Building a High-Performance Culture

00:35:16 — Building a Life Around Family

00:36:17 — Redefining Success

00:40:20 — Why We Double Down Under Pressure

00:45:18 — Coaching and Accountability

00:50:31 — The Grounded Man Hike 

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

So now, especially when I have my daughter, I want to spend as much time with her as I can and not miss any of those special moments of you know her first cr crawling for the first time or eating or walking or whatever it may be. So I wanted to build a life that would allow me to do that. I mean, as we said, it's nine o'clock on a Monday morning, um, and neither of us are in the office, neither of us are rushing to meetings, and so it's a really nice place to be.

SPEAKER_00 0:34

Welcome to the Grounded Man podcast by Deru. I am your host, John Douglas, and founder of Deru. And this space is for hardworking men building businesses, carrying responsibility, and providing for their families who feel they should be freer. You see, the world has changed, and leading through hard work and long hours now limits a man's influence. The new way is mastering the inner game of leadership so you can carry it well, enjoy what you're building, and still feel free. Deru is leadership for the 21st century. I'm joined by Sam Hart. I suppose Sam, maybe just give us a little bit of a lowdown of who you are, where you're from, how we met.

SPEAKER_01 1:21

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, John, thanks very much for having me on. As you said, it's uh I think quarter past nine on a Monday morning here. Yeah, and normally you'd be rushing into the office or rushing off to a meeting or doing something uh you know like that. Uh busy, busy work, so it's great to be out walking in the woods in Wicklow here. Yeah, I'm Sam Hartam, director of Heart Outdoor Lighting. We are a family business in Wexford, and we've been handmaking high-quality outdoor lighting for over 40 years. The company was set up by my father, Willie, and now myself, my brother, and my mother run the company today, carry on his legacy. We still follow the same formula that he put down in making the lights and the products. So we really emphasize quality within the company, so we offer a lifetime guarantee on our products as well. So we're now we've entered into a new phase of LED technology offering high performance solutions and different things like that. So it's great to see the company evolve uh in the last few years as well.

SPEAKER_00 2:32

Yeah, and if anyone hasn't uh seen Heart Outdoor Lighting, go and check out the website. Uh and the quality, I can assure you, the quality there, you won't find it anywhere else in the world. So um it's uh it's a credit to you and your family, Sam.

SPEAKER_01 2:45

Thanks, John. Yeah, yeah, and uh as I said, it's funny, it's it's a formula that that my dad developed. He he always wanted to control the quality in-house in Wexford because when you outsource things you lose the quality, so it was always very important to keep things in-house and hand make it, and we just haven't evolved that process. I know a lot of companies need to innovate, and we've innovated in different areas, but really our manufacturing process and um has remained the same. We've introduced new measures across the board. How big is the company now, and kind of what's the setup now? Yeah, we have um over 20 employees now. Uh we export to over eight countries, so we have channels set up across Europe, the United States, the UK, um, and then domestically, of course, we have a big domestic market with the residential customer who would buy for their own garden. We work a lot with county councils and contractors who work with county councils, and we're doing a lot of refurbishment and retrofit work at the moment. So, obviously, we're very big on longevity of products, and more recently, it's been great to go into towns and cities across Ireland and look at their existing lighting. Um, and instead of replacing with new fixtures, we're actually taking down those fixtures, we're bringing them back to our base in Wexford, we're refurbishing them, even though they might be heart brand, they might not be heart brand, and we're putting the latest LED technology in it. So instead of throwing it out and getting in something new, you're reusing what's already there. So a very sustainable approach, and everything, as I said, is all done in Wexford. We have a team of skilled craftspeople there who've been a lot of them who've been with us for over 20 years, so they know the company inside out and know the product inside out too.

SPEAKER_00 4:42

And who would be some of the customers that like listeners today would just kind of know? Who would be some of those uh customers that you'd have?

SPEAKER_01 4:49

Yeah, we've been very lucky. Five I I normally go straight for the five-star hotels, Adair Manor, Ashford Castle, Mount Juliet, yeah, Galgorm, um yeah, the Orison Nuke Dron, Leinster House, Dublin City Council, throughout Dublin City Council. So we've been very, very lucky. We've had some really nice clients, and then of course, thousands and thousands of residential customers across Ireland, the UK, Europe as well. So, yeah, we've been um we've been very fortunate. Fantastic.

SPEAKER_00 5:21

Yeah, so Sam, tell us a bit about uh how we met and kind of where you are when we met.

SPEAKER_01 5:28

Yeah, it's funny actually. We we both went to the same conference, didn't we? And we just happened to sit down beside each other. Yeah, and fate brought us together. Fate, yeah, that's it, exactly. Uh so it was funny, and I think straight away um we connected on mindset and the importance of mindset, and how I think we both had this awareness straight away when we met each other that we we both felt that there was more to life than the daily grind of 9 to 5 and stressing on your way into work, being stressed out all day, coming home to your family, not having enough energy for them. And I think we just probably knew there was more to life than just that lifestyle. Would that be fair to say?

SPEAKER_00 6:13

Yeah, I think so. And I remember from that first day, was uh I remember I got it, I got the bus or the train up or something, but you were driving back to Wexford, and thankfully, uh, I suppose most Wexford people will say that that's the only good thing about Wicklow is uh you know the road down to Wexford or something. But uh I got a lift home from you that day, and we kind of spent the whole hour. It seemed to fly by um talking about mindset and talking about I suppose having the right approach. I remember that at the time we were talking a lot about purpose as well in your life and kind of what that purpose is or was, and maybe because you would kind of come home from you had been working in the US and you were coming home and I suppose trying to find I kind of suppose maybe you just get settled back in. Um it's I don't know, whatever. How would you describe it?

SPEAKER_01 6:56

Yeah, I think purpose would have definitely been the the number one thing. Um, and I've always known that having purpose in a role was really, really important. Like it just wasn't enough for me to go in and do your nine to five job in exchange for money, you know. I just knew that there had to be something deeper within a role than just getting money. And had you found out with some other roles you had worked that it was a bit transactional like that, yeah. Perhaps, but I was very fortunate in that I grew up uh riding horses, and then I I got involved in the thoroughbred industry, and I had some amazing experiences in the thoroughbred industry, and I followed my passion, and I was able to work with my passion as well, and that was that was amazing. And then when I came back to Ireland, it was probably yeah, it was probably purpose was the main thing I was really searching for within a role. Um, so yeah, I think it was it was good to start working together and kind of going a little bit deeper. And I I suppose I've always been someone who's been very curious about different things. I I don't necessarily like to take them as they are, I like to go a little bit deeper, understand them a little bit better instead of just maybe pushing through and getting on with it. Um I sort of ask why, and I'm quite curious, and at that point it was definitely purpose.

SPEAKER_00 8:16

So Sam, what was the curiosity that was driving you to kind of maybe think more about your life, think deeper?

SPEAKER_01 8:24

Yeah, I I think in some of the harder times it opens up this space for more curiosity. You know, obviously, we're all faced with challenges in working in business, and a lot of the times those challenges have just kind of made me work deeper on myself. I've gone looking for more and more answers instead of just accepting it and moving on. And I think it's a good mindset in that. You know, one thing we always say is who knows what's good and what's bad. Exactly. And I I love that saying, I try to apply it as much as I can. Something happens in work and in business, who knows what's good and what's bad? Even if it's what you think in that moment the worst thing ever, wait six months, a year, five years, and look back and say, God, thank God that happened because it's now changed the whole trajectory in a positive way. Yeah, so you never know what's and it's really hard in that moment not to get too hung up on it, but if you can react to it, yeah, exactly, not to react, but if you can kind of sit in it and say, Right, what lessons are here, what can I learn from it, and how can we move forward? But that saying, who knows what's good and what's bad is really really good, and that's uh something that comes up in our calls a lot. I know you're uh you like that saying as well. Yeah, it's really about you, I suppose you don't know in that moment where harder times or decisions are gonna lead you, and if you can take that mindset and the approach of there's a learning in everything, no matter what the scenario is, yeah, and move on from it, learn from it, but don't dwell on it because it's it's in the past, it's already happened, so the only thing ahead now is the future.

SPEAKER_00 10:06

I think that's uh I think that's obviously very wise. I think there's a lot of times when you're in that moment, it's very easy to look at the negative thing, to look at the problem, to look at the the pain. And I suppose the more you look at that, especially if you've come from a lot of like hard work grinded, and when those moments happen, you're kind of told to push harder, which maybe at some times it is the right decision, but not maybe not always. Uh, and maybe sometimes you actually need to step back and say, Well, am I doing is is what I'm doing the right way of doing it. Um, because I think in those moments you can you kind of have two options. You either try and control more, and that's kind of what the ego will look what will kind of guide you down that it needs it feels it needs to know everything, and it will almost trick us into s into telling us that it knows everything and it knows best. And so therefore it gets us to try and control the situation or to control it more. But the other option then is that you have that is probably less talked about because it's a bit more it's probably a little bit more less masculine in some ways, is the idea of trust and trusting the process, and that requires, I suppose, a degree of faith, and like that, like the the the Chinese farmer that were saying who knows what's good or what's bad, um he was kind of trusting in something you know greater than himself that he didn't know where this was going. Uh it could have gone, it could have turned out to be something very positive in the end, or it might have been turned out to be something very negative in the end, but ultimately he didn't he wasn't trying to control something he couldn't control, which is probably the unfoldments of our lives. And I think that's I don't know, I just wanted to add that kind of each. I don't know if you have any comments on that.

SPEAKER_01 11:39

It makes sense. I think what you said there about doubling down. I think men in particular, I think something goes wrong, you double down and you push through instead of taking a step back. There's a lovely saying about meditation, a funny one. It's um everyone should meditate for 30 minutes a day. Unless you're busy, then it should be an hour a day. Yeah, and I think working on yourself and the work that you uh propose is quite the same. I think I think everyone should be doing it for it's not necessarily a time a day, but you know, hypothetically, everyone should be doing it for an hour a day. Unless you're busy, then you should be doing two hours a day because that's when you need it most. But what happens is the opposite is you get into the grind and you push through, you put the head down, you drive on, and um that's when the stress builds up, and then I think sometimes that's when the the stress can even start to show up in the body in you know different areas as well. So I think that's uh I think there's a really good lesson in that.

SPEAKER_00 12:37

And what way has stress shown up for you, maybe in the in the body over the last whatever, as far as you can remember.

SPEAKER_01 12:44

Yeah, I I think it it definitely will come through, and it's still an area I'm not I'm probably not best to speak on it, and I'm still only learning about it, but I think it'll definitely show up in in tiredness, I think in low mood, and you know, not being totally there, not being totally present. I think when you're when you have the awareness to realise that you're going to work every day switched off, you're kind of just in the car, you're not thinking about your surroundings, you're on robot mode. If you can catch yourself in that awareness, that's probably you know the time to do it now before it kind of gets further down along the lines of of burnout. But um, yeah, yeah, I definitely notice myself when I can get my thoughts in a good place, you know, emotionally in a good place. Um, the rest of my life improves, you know. You definitely attract what you put it.

SPEAKER_00 13:39

Where do you find your head being then if it's not present? You know, you said is maybe it's it's kind of switched off in terms of not to switch it off that we talk about going on holiday switched off, but maybe just not you're kind of doing all the things your body is moving to the places it needs to be, but like maybe your head is elsewhere, like where where can it be? Is it is it stuck in the future, is it stuck in the past, is it a mix of both? Is it in your own experience?

SPEAKER_01 14:05

Yeah, I I think it's the it's the thoughts, so it's definitely a mixture of the of the past and the future, and um thoughts are a funny thing. Um another saying, I'm saying a few sayings today, but another saying I really like fire here is um I am not my thoughts, I am the presence beneath my thoughts, and that alone just saying I am not my thoughts, it the my thoughts don't define me was kind of an eye-opening thing for me, kind of a light bulb moment because I always knew I had thoughts in my head, and I thought they were me and they define me, but they don't necessarily at all because you can also have three or four different thoughts at the one time, you know. You can walk out of a meeting and go, I shouldn't have said that, and then another thought comes in and said, No, no, no, you you did great, you should have said that, and then another thought comes in and says, Well, you could have said it this way. So, how can all of those thoughts be me?

SPEAKER_00 15:02

It just doesn't and you spend the next hour in your head who seeing who's the winner, like you know. Yeah, exactly. Uh it's like you can't, yeah, you're contradicting yourself in your own head. Exactly. So so that those thoughts to show you the ridiculousness of our minds sometimes, yeah. You know, you'd you'd be kind of uh you might define that in the past, it might have been defined that's that's the signs of a crazy person. Yeah, all of our minds do that, yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 15:27

Exactly. I know, and and the thing is we're listening to it then is maybe the worst. Well, like which of those voices do you listen to? But then you ultimately probably take one on board, and then that sort of defines you. So I think to go back to your question, then it's when I'm in that state, it's that probably that thoughts, it's the busyness, it's the the mental chatter that's going on and on, and um, you know, obviously the beauty of it is to find the present, get in the present where you're not thinking about the past, not thinking about the future, and just be totally present in in that moment.

SPEAKER_00 16:01

So the present is an interesting interesting kind of idea. I use the word idea because you know, if I said to you, uh, I need you to go to your car, you'd know where your car is and you'd be able to direct yourself there and go into it and drive wherever you need to get to. But if I said to you, like Sam, be present, it's a very it's not like so easy just to be present, is it?

SPEAKER_01 16:25

It's definitely not, no. And I think there's a lot of things around say meditation as well. I think when people say be present, they imagine a monk, you know, levitating in far west Mongolia or wherever, but it's it's not necessarily that. I mean, you can find simple present moments in your everyday life, like rubbing your two fingertips together and just thinking and feeling about that.

SPEAKER_00 16:51

Does that just bring you more bring you into the present moment? Yeah, like yeah, just especially the focus on something that you can actually feel right now, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 16:58

And then you're not thinking about the past, you're not thinking about the future, eating mindfully, actually tasting the ingredients in your food.

SPEAKER_00 17:06

Um slowing down then a lot.

SPEAKER_01 17:08

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 17:09

Yeah, so when their mind is racing, you need to actually slow down. Yeah, that's a good message, I think. Yeah, um so if things are going too quick and you feel like really busy and you don't have the time, you don't own your own headspace, you don't own your own energy, it's about actually well, slow that down, and that's probably coming back to the the guy that said about the meditation that if you're busy, you need to do twice as much of it because you're the person that actually needs it.

SPEAKER_01 17:32

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 17:33

Yeah, exactly. You know, or could benefit from it most.

SPEAKER_01 17:36

Yeah, exactly, exactly. So I mean, is what does the present moment mean for you or to be present?

SPEAKER_00 17:43

Is that are we kind of dis aligned on that or yeah, uh, I think being present for me, I think it's I think I've found it easier as the more I talk about it with uh with guys like yourself and other business owners that I work with, um in terms of how much are you enjoying it? I think that's a good I think that's uh it's almost like a better indicator of it, or also about your level of freedom. How free do you feel? Free in terms of your your energy is flowing well, you're in maybe you might describe it as a flow state, free in terms of like your your mind might try to race, but you're actually able to let go of a lot of the worries and let go of a lot of like the past failures that maybe keep coming back to haunt you. Um like so you're not you're not letting that stuff control how you think. Uh, and then free in terms of also your time, where you're getting to spend your um your time on things that you find a lot of meaning in and enjoy. So I think that whole enjoyment, freedom, and peace of mind, they're kind of like three words I would associate that if you're feeling more of those things and experiencing more of those things, you probably are more present. And so, yes, that's the way I look at it. I also see bre presence as in a different way as a gateway to your to you to you as a person. Because you know, you can we we uh we we spoke about you know, when things happen, you might double down, you might do more or work harder or work longer. And so a lot of the times we think that we're not working hard enough, or we need to do more, and so we're counting the hours. But when you think about it, like what's built your business, what's built your career, what's built everything in your life, it's the parts of you that are you, it's like it's your desires, it's your purpose, it's your strengths, it's your passions, maybe even your frustrations, your experiences, your wisdom, it's all that coming together that you can bring into the into your business, let's say, and um and let that create the most impact, let that grow the business the best, uh, let that um I don't suppose attract people in who are kind of a good fit for what you're trying to build and where you're trying to get to, and whether that's your team or whether that's clients. So I think being present allows you to be more impactful to those around you. So it's not just about, as you said, the monk who's maybe has that peace of mind or that level of freedom, but like he's not maybe maybe he's not having impact on the world at the same time. So I think when you want to live in the real world but still have the peace of mind, you kind of have to uh you have to think uh think in terms of practical as well as I suppose maybe the more abstract or just just the energy of it.

SPEAKER_01 20:24

And if I I know this is one thing I struggled at at the start, I kind of had that idea of a monk, you know, to get I needed to be in that state, it was all or nothing. I didn't realise I could find the present moment simply. So I suppose if there's someone listening to this podcast now and they're kind of saying, you know, how how do I find it? Like, what's your kind of actionable practical plan to say, right, here's two or three things you can do today to get as a starting point that will lead to more. But if you're kind of at base level now, what can they do today to practically kind of get towards that present moment more easily?

SPEAKER_00 21:02

I'm gonna do what I do best, Sam, put that back on you. Yeah, because you're the one that's been through the last few years. So, what would you recommend? I I give you just little things, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:13

I we uh you introduced this thing called the leadership hour at the start, and I found that really beneficial, and that is an hour of reflection and awareness every day, and generally try to fit it in in the morning before the busyness of everything, and that is a time for meditation, breathing, um gratitude, gratitude, writing it, visualizing your goals, visualizing, yeah, exactly. So, I mean, if you're just if if you're just starting, I would put that hour aside first of all, and then switch off the phone. Now, what you do within that hour for the first time, I would come with a set plan. So, John just called out some things, I would write out those as headings and talk about them a little bit more, but just Spend that hour, that leadership hour. I think that's a really good starting point.

SPEAKER_00 22:03

And even if you got that in a few times a week, or even if you decided to do 20 minutes a morning to do something, just to give yourself that time, it's it's about starting, isn't it? Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, it is. It's about creating that distance. I think that's the self-awareness piece, because you said I am not my thoughts. And that's when you that's that's about self-awareness, because the more aware you are that you're not your thoughts, then the more you can see yourself within your own surroundings, you can see yourself separate from them. Exactly. Uh and when you because when you don't see yourself separate from them, your identity is tied to them. Exactly. Yeah, and so when your identity is tied to them, everything feels like a personal threat. Because if it's in if it's in the you know, if it's your if your wife, it's your kids, if it's your neighbours, if it's your friends, if it's your business, it doesn't matter where it comes from, everything feels like a personal threat when your identity is tied to it. So I think that whole piece about reflection is kind of seeing that, well, this is what I'm thinking, but actually maybe the way I'm thinking actually, why am I thinking that? Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 23:01

Yeah. And and sometimes even even if you if none of those you you don't have those headings say to start with, even just writing, like what comes down onto the page. Like I find writing it out on the page and getting your thoughts on a page is a brilliant starting point because right now what's annoying you, even or what's frustrating you, or what's yeah, you know, and and uh just getting it on to get it out of the head is exactly. That's all you need is a is a pen and paper, and switch off the phone, close the door wherever you are, no distractions, that hour is for you because it's like that oxygen mask analogy. It's when the plane is going down, uh you know, put your oxygen mask on before anyone else's, and it's kind of like that within a business as well. You know, you have to put your oxygen mask on first before thinking of other things. And I know that sounds selfish, I know that goes against probably everything that society says or that men should do or women should do, mothers should do, exactly. But um, yeah, I think that's that's really important.

SPEAKER_00 24:04

Yeah, it's an interesting point. Why do you feel that you've shifted over to doing that then, like creating that time for yourself, and whether it's the more the meditation, or whether it's going for a run or a swim or whether it's doing something, why do you see the value in that, or why do why have you given yourself the permission to do that? Well, it's the it's the results really.

SPEAKER_01 24:23

The the more you the more I put into myself, the the better results, the better the outcome. It's like anything in life, really. It's the more you put in, the more you get out. So when you start seeing things change in a positive way, and also you can't control bad things happening or negative things happening, you can do all the meditation and everything, and things can still go wrong, but when they go wrong, you're in a much better state to deal with them, and I think that was really really important. Um, you know, it doesn't necessarily mean that you'll do all this amazing work and your life will be perfect, but again, when the things go wrong, then you go back to who knows what's good and what's bad.

SPEAKER_00 25:03

So yeah, yeah, because I think there might be a thought that some of this kind of work or enjoying it more or releasing the pressure is escaping the responsibility.

SPEAKER_01 25:13

Exactly, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:14

But would you say, would you agree with that?

SPEAKER_01 25:16

Um no, I mean it's definitely not escaping the responsibility. I think it gives you the it holds you accountable as well, and I think that's one great thing about the calls uh part of your coaching program is every week we have a morning call, and that accountability is so so important as well, and that's holding yourself responsible to the work that you're doing. And I think that's that's a very important thing as well. Accountability, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:50

So the the idea that the idea that like you're trying to focus and more get your energy better so you can enjoy it more, that's you're kind of saying that's incre that's increasing your results because often I would find sometimes it's obviously it's easier to say, well, if I if I just do a bit more, I might get better results, and that might be working on something you know, just the work that you have to do in the business, but like where you actually give yourself permission and prioritize some some kind of self-development work, you're saying you're seeing good results from that, yeah, because of that. Yeah, definitely. How do you link that up? Sound like how have you seen that link up in your own experience?

SPEAKER_01 26:28

I I put it down to energy, I think it's very simple. How energetic do I feel every day? I and I think that's so important. I think of course there's other things like you know, I don't know, whatever your goals may be, whether they're material or more personable, but I just bring it back to a daily life. It's like when I wake up in the morning am I more energetic than I was five, six years ago, or am I more excited for life? And really, ultimately, that's the most important thing. My health is my health in a good place, and this work just reinforces all of that and makes everything so much better.

SPEAKER_00 27:08

And how does that make a difference though? When you're thinking about your thinking, your decisions, your actions, and then the results in the business, like because you know, there's there's probably maybe some people listening to this. It all sounds good in theory, but maybe it seems a bit of a luxury to kind of go and take that time to work on yourself. Um, it's a nice to have how is that the way you see it, or do you see it differently? Like, do you see it actually know that it's more like a cornerstone of all the results? Like, how does this how does it kind of how does it manifest as out, if you like?

SPEAKER_01 27:40

Yeah, I I I think it gave me within a business point of view, I can kind of use that as an example. It gave me the confidence and the authority, which sounds like a weird way to say it, but the confidence definitely to work on the business and not in the business, so you know you're not getting stuck in the weeds, but you see yourself as a business leader, so you need to be the one who can help direct strategy, generate sales, bring in the next level of the business, really. Whereas before, and I know a lot of business owners, particularly small business owners, will be stuck in the daily grind of putting out fires and answering calls and that sort of thing.

SPEAKER_00 28:20

But and so if you aren't doing that work on yourself and you said your confidence wouldn't have been as high, like what decisions would you not have made?

SPEAKER_01 28:29

Yeah, I think when you're working in the business all the time, and it's funny, it's a bit like working on yourself when you don't take a step back and sit down and become aware of and analyze and go through your learnings and so on and so forth. You can't really go further in the company. I mean, how does any company go from sort of you know, I don't know if you only use employees or revenue, but 10 employees to 20 to 200? I mean, at the back of that all, there is a strategy in place somewhere, and um, there's a a business leader within that organization thinking strategically, not on the shop floor or not on the the retail floor, actually selling the goods, you know.

SPEAKER_00 29:13

Yeah, or managing what has to happen this week. Yeah, exactly. Somebody thinking a bit more long term, exactly. Yeah, yeah, exactly. It's funny because most of like I think a lot of the difference between being a leader and being a manager is thinking. You know, a leader will always think before they act, where the manager, and I'm just I'm just using this as kind of identity. The manager might be like the one who kind of keeps everything organized and going and planning week to week. Uh, but the leader is the one who's thinking, how do I need to strengthen the team? How do I how can we bring in more clients next year? How can we raise our prices and still hold on to our current current clients? Or how uh what partnerships, where are the opportunities, where are the partnerships I can build? So all of that is thinking, and so it's again it's breaking away from the old mindset of doing, doing, doing more, because when you take that time to you said to work on the business, it's thinking time, and so you have to kind of value yourself beyond what you do to actually what you can create. Uh, and I think that's I think you've you've linked up nicely there, like somebody who's kind of willing to work on themselves is probably more willing to work on their business because they see the the results of that, or maybe vice versa. Somebody who's working on the business probably sees actually, maybe there's a benefit to working on myself in this as well, um, which I think links up nicely.

SPEAKER_01 30:30

And I think it filters then through, you know, your senior your senior managers, you can pull them in on the journey, and yeah, there's just an overall feeling, I think. If you can share some of that knowledge and some of that thinking, I mean you want your senior managers to be thinking along your lines as well. You don't want them to necessarily be working in the business. So I think you're you're right. Once you can figure it out, then you can translate it, and then once you show up every day doing as you should be doing and as you want to be doing, then everyone will follow suit as well.

SPEAKER_00 31:02

So, what's like two or three key things that have happened in your business over the last few years since you've started maybe thinking more for yourself and working on yourself and working on the business more as well? Yeah, well, I I suppose it doesn't have to be like big massive sales figures, and there might be the rubber there anyway, but more so like I'm always looking at the cause and effect, and sometimes the effects of what we're doing today, we can't actually see it, and maybe it takes more than even 12 months to see, it might take five years to see it. Yeah, so but in terms of the cause of that, which is maybe as you said, getting the senior management team on the same page as you, or some of the let's say the the alignment in the organization or the cultural shifts in the organization. What's even looking at that side of things rather than just the outcomes, what do you see in changes? Uh changes taking place.

SPEAKER_01 31:50

Yeah, we've made a lot of positive changes, both on the production floor in terms of the handmaking of the product, and one big area where we've invested a lot is lean management, which is a Japanese concept that basically came from Toyota being one of the biggest companies to adopt lean. Um, and lean basically brings in this idea of standardization and high performance mindset within the company. So we evaluated the full company on the eight wastes of lean, which is a really good exercise, and I'd advise anyone who has a business to look up the eight wastes of lean and evaluate their company based in those eight areas, yeah. And um, small things like we do a 3S every day where everyone cleans their space and everyone has a standard operating procedure and what they need to do in their certain area as well. So lean was I know that all sounds very mechanical and very management oriented, but really from a cultural perspective, when you strip it back, it's it's really a cultural thing, you know, something as simple as everyone taking 15 minutes to clean an area or certain area, so that could be the toilets all the way to their workstations.

SPEAKER_00 33:04

But so it sounds like efficiency, but actually it's really about respect.

SPEAKER_01 33:07

It's about respect, and I think you know, when people respect their area and clean their area, they're gonna have a better respect for making the product for the customers and so on and so forth, so for each other, exactly. Yeah, and it also creates this standard, you know, of high performance, really, and holding people accountable as well. And it's not a blame game, it's not in there to go in and blame someone you did it wrong, or so on, so forth, make people feel small, you know. Generally, you'll try and blame the process, not the individual, but it is a chance for us to all look at the process and look individually at the workings of the company and go right where are we falling down, where can we be better, where are we wasting time? That's the eight waste of lean, um, and what can we learn from it as well. So, that's been a big one. And then on the sales front, we have we had a really good product. Uh it was really lucky to come to a company, even it's family business, that had such a good product and such a good name and a good reputation. But we've now upgraded our products to have high performance LEDs, and that's really at drive help help with sales as well. So, yeah, I think it's about looking at what you have and then how you can build on it and what's where your strengths are currently.

SPEAKER_00 34:24

Yeah. What is the thing you're most I'm sorry, you know, I should say as well, we didn't say at the start, but you've become a father in the last 12 months as well, which is a whole new exact uh world opened up to you talking uh instead of talking about uh whatever holidays and nights away, it's more talking about like prams and yeah, yeah, other things like that. Exactly, 100%. Even in terms of I suppose taking everything into account, what do you feel like you're most proud of yourself for in the last few years?

SPEAKER_01 34:51

What I'm most proud of in the last few years would be adopting the this approach of working working on myself and putting more time into myself, and um while it might sound selfish, it definitely helps me show up in every other aspect of of my life. And I always knew that I wanted to be there always for for family, like the the work-life balance, of course, is is talked about a lot, yeah. And I was always very big on ensuring that I had a really good work-life balance, and now especially when I have my daughter, I want to spend as much time with her as I can and not miss any of those special moments of you know her first crawling for the first time or eating or walking or whatever it may be. So I wanted to build a life that would allow me to do that. I mean, as we said, it's nine o'clock on a Monday morning, um, and neither of us are in the office, neither of us are rushing to meetings, and so it's a really nice place to be. And I'm very fortunate that I can step away and and do this sort of thing and have time to work on myself, and then also have time with her, but also get really great enjoyment out of growing a family business and and um seeing exports grow across the world and carrying on my father's legacy and a company that my mother and father built together. It's fantastic.

SPEAKER_00 36:17

And so is that what kind of success is for you? Being able to kind of live that life that encapsulates or encompasses all the things that are most important to you, or is success still about the numbers, or do I suppose maybe the day matter as much, or what's no success is is definitely about the the daily energy.

SPEAKER_01 36:39

That's what I keep coming back to. You know, it's you don't have to overly complicate it and say success is about massive earning millions and millions and things like that. I just bring it back to the daily experience, how you live your days is how you live your life, and if you're living your day every day stressed out, but then on the weekend you blow off some steam, have a good time, and then you go back into the office on a Monday and you work really hard again to the next Friday, and then you go off for the weekend. I mean, you're not really living your your best life, so it's all about every single day. How do you live your day today? That's how you live your life when you look back, and um, that's the most important thing, and so that leadership hour in the morning that we talked about, I think that's a really good time to understand right what are the important things to me in life, and what are the things that give me energy? How can I spend way more time doing those things? And then the things that drain my energy, how can I stop doing them? Delegate them, yeah. Delegate them. Is there some other way you can get them out of your life? Or you know, even if you can get to 80% energy tasks every single day, 20% energy drainers, and then I think once you get into a better energy, you'll sort of attract other things in your life and in uh better energy too. So, I mean, does that resonate with you as well?

SPEAKER_00 38:01

I think so, yeah. I think it resonates with a lot of the the clients that I've been working with now, especially over a year, who have kind of maybe come to me a lot of the time because they're carrying a business on their back and a lot of responsibility, but the responsibility is all this was the only way they've known to carry it is through pressure, and it's and that's really come back to survival. It's like we need to we need to get through this, and there's a there's a big like kind of push on to survive, and we're trying to kind of reframe that mindset that actually, well, what about beyond just surviving? What about if you what does it look like if you're thriving? What does that look like? What does that kind of week look like? And I suppose being in your best energy is probably when you're you're thriving, and that daily energy, I think a lot of the guys have set their goals for the next 12 months. A lot of them have set it on being more present and having a higher energy every day because they I suppose have this self-awareness now at this stage that they know that it actually doesn't really matter what happens, because if I'm in a good energy, I'm gonna think the best, think the most positive I can about it, and I'm gonna take the best actions and make the best decisions, and that will ultimately lead me to more prosperity or or abundance in the future, rather than if I'm in a low energy, I'm stressed about it. Everyone's feeding off that in the in the business, so therefore, like that affects the culture. Um, it's a reactive kind of firefighting culture, and therefore we're we're kind of going nowhere, we're we're stagnant, and every every little thing that happens then feels like a threat that's going to shut down the business. And so it's about reframing all that, letting go of all that, because that's just a lot of that's just baggage, and a lot of that comes from what you said, your mind is thinking to things back into the past and what uh what meaning it gave to some events that happened in your life, you know, that maybe nearly broke you, or that maybe made you that hurt you, or made the you think made a fool out of you in the past, or all those kind of things can kind of keep coming back up as you're going through life. And I suppose it's just as you said, being aware of them and taking that time to kind of think about them and why they're there, so you can kind of let them go because they're not if they if they carry on into the future, then it doesn't matter how much opportunity is going to come, you're always gonna feel like you're struggling, or you're always gonna feel like you're just surviving or the pressure and not enjoying it.

SPEAKER_01 40:16

And why why do you think you when things get hard, we double down? Like, why why don't we have this awareness innate within us to kind of take a step back? Why is it is it a man thing? Is it only men? Do women not do it so much, or what where does it come from, do you think? To keep doing more, yeah, to keep doing more and and just bursting through instead of actually taking a step back.

SPEAKER_00 40:42

Uh control. So the ego, the ego wants to survive, and so the ego tie it ties survival to identity. So if I if I can if my identity survives, then I survive. That's the way the ego thinks. Right. And so what we're trying to do the whole time is when we're doubling down more, is trying to hold on to something tighter. Do you know when you have a there's like you're negotiating a sale with, you know, maybe it's a big contract, maybe it's your biggest contract ever for the business, and there's so much weight riding on it because this is like this is the one, this is the one that's going to take us to the next level.

SPEAKER_01 41:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 41:16

And then it do then it starts to go against you. Your whole mindset is kind of tied into the outcome. Like if this goes through, we'll make it. If this doesn't, I'll fail. So your whole success and failure is based on an outcome. So you're trying to control something. Um, but the funny thing is you can't actually control those things. All you can do is show up at your best and be in the best energy and try and understand the person who's who you're who you're selling your products to, to understand their needs and see if your needs are your product or solution is the best solution for them. In that regard, you might try to do is you might try and ring them more, you might try to give them more, you might try to, you might underprice yourself to try and get it over the line. So it's all we're trying to do is survive, basically. So the ego's trying to survive and it does it through that identity, and so it wants to protect that. So anything that looks like that's gonna make me look like a failure, that almost means like debt to the ego. And so that's the whole idea of doubling down. Whereas you go beyond that and go back into well, what's actually true for me inside. Well, the truth is if this deal does go through or not, I'm still gonna be here.

SPEAKER_01 42:21

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 42:22

That's the actual truth. My team is gonna be here. Yes, it might be like the financial situation might be any better, but we're still gonna be here. At worst, we'll still be surviving. But me getting hung up about it and putting extra pressure on myself to do more and control more isn't helping. For a lot of the cases, it's not helping. And so that's why you go back to the idea, the dynamic between control, which is a masculine kind of energy, not a man thing, masculine, which is different to man, and feminine of trust is more of a feminine uh energy. Again, not female, feminine. It's a different thing, it's not nothing to do with gender, it's to do with kind of polarity of energy.

SPEAKER_01 42:59

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 43:01

So that's why that's why I think we're trained to do that. Because we're in control, is what you try and do when you're in when you're surviving. There's the more you can control, the better chances you have.

SPEAKER_01 43:12

Yeah, yeah, and that definitely resonates, especially you you get a big quote in or a big opportunity in, you drop everything just for this one order, and yeah, you're you're definitely guilty of that of just doubling down and pushing through, like it's the most important thing, and letting everything else suffer around. So that definitely resonates.

SPEAKER_00 43:34

Yeah. So, Sam, looking ahead to the future, what are you most excited about?

SPEAKER_01 43:41

I've a loads of things to be excited about, uh, which is great. Starting first with with family life and my daughter, and watching her grow up and being so involved in it, of course, is uh is amazing with my wife and doing that all together. So, first thing that came to mind is definitely. Definitely family there, then working going deeper on this area of mindset and challenging myself because it's when you when I find when I start to hit a lull or hit a bit of a plateau, is when I start to get a little bit agitated and frustrated. So I have to keep going deeper and learning more, studying more, and I really enjoy it. I'm a curious person, as I said, it's you know everyone has different things, what excites them, and um this is it for me, and I know you feel the same way as well. And then the business, of course, there's so much to be excited about within the business. We're a growing company and carrying on the legacy, as I said, and it's really nice story for my parents, and now doing it with my with my brother as well, uh, and keeping the business going and not going but thriving for all the employees who've been with us for 20 plus years and the community in in Wexford, so yeah, there's an awful lot to be excited about, and um definitely will continue on working on myself in all these areas too. Fantastic.

SPEAKER_00 45:18

Sam, how did you find the experience of kind of working on yourself with somebody with a coach?

SPEAKER_01 45:23

Yeah, it's been great, and I've worked with a number of coaches, they've been fantastic. I I it's it in business, it's it's strange because when you say that people probably cringe a little bit, and I probably cringe at the start to admit it as well. But in a sporting context, it's completely normal. Like the high performance athletes have a coach in every single area, and I'm not comparing myself to Rory Mackle right now or anything by any means, but like he only has a tournament once every few weekends, you're you're on the go 92. Yeah, exactly. That's true. Yeah, it needs a private jet to fly around in it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But uh, yeah, so it it's kind of a weird thing in business, I suppose. A lot of people will will cringe, but I have found it hugely beneficial. It's uh the number one thing would be accountability for me. I love our sessions, one-on-one sessions together, and then we have a weekly call with other like-minded business leaders, yeah, with a pod, and that's brilliant because we we do I love the mastermind sessions where we throw out a question and it could be anything to do with business or life, and we put it to the floor, and the other business uh owners in the group then can pitch in. And it's funny, even though we're different industries, uh, a lot of the time our problems are the same, whether it's around trying to grow sales or HR or maybe it's something personal and nothing to do with the business at all. But I find that platform really good.

SPEAKER_00 46:47

So it's a space for you to kind of connect with like-minded people.

SPEAKER_01 46:51

Definitely, yeah, and even the hikes have been fantastic as well. Getting out into nature, I think, is brilliant. I think when you're out of the office setting, it's so much easier to chat. Like, even this podcast recording it in the woods, it's lovely to come outside and chat and not necessarily sit across a table, you're moving, it's a bit freer, feels more natural. I always find that you know, when you're not even sitting directly across from someone, it's better. Like driving in a car, it's you have a great conversation sometimes than actually sitting across from a table. So getting out of your comfort zone and and having a chat is is brilliant. So, yeah, but as I said, the coaching for me is accountability. I like to have a clear set of goals, uh, to work on things that I need to improve, the awareness of them all, and then check back in in a week's time. Well, how are we doing? What went right, what went wrong, and just like back to that athlete, as I said, you know, they're so caught up in their daily grind of practicing. If we use a golfer practicing every day, getting to the next tournament, whatever they have, media, there does there's no one actually looking at them if they don't have a coach, and I think business owners are a bit the same.

SPEAKER_00 48:06

Yeah, um, they don't have especially when you're leading a group of people, like you're leading a team of whatever it is, 20, 30, 40, 50, 100 people, like to not have somebody by your side. You know, if you think about some of the the big emperors back in the day of the Roman Empires, they all had a council of advisors and they all had these people that were kind of mentoring them. Exactly. Exactly, 100%. So, what were you most surprised about our time together, working together, whether it's the one-to-one or the group or anything else, uh maybe from either the process of it or what you got out of it? What was most surprising?

SPEAKER_01 48:40

I I I was I was so surprised how much I how much I enjoyed it. It probably felt very much uncomfortable initially, especially talking like this now, or oh feeling like you're opening up a little bit, maybe perhaps. But yeah, it was I was surprised how much I enjoyed it the deeper I got into it, um how much of my life, uh much of a part of my life it became um from there, and actually led me to be curious in other areas and lead on to to more things as well. So it doesn't feel heavy, it doesn't feel like a burden, you know. It never feels like I don't know, homework or anything like that.

SPEAKER_00 49:21

Um you're not carrying a big bag uh there.

SPEAKER_01 49:24

No, no, no, I'm not, I'm not, definitely not. No, so there's no no written homework or exams or anything like that. So uh no weight, no, exactly, and then it just goes back to to the results. Once you start to see the results, you start to feel it in yourself, you start to see your internal and your external environment improve for the better. How you're influencing it, how you're influencing it. I think you really start to oh yeah, you I think you start to enjoy it, enjoy it more.

SPEAKER_00 49:51

Well, Sam, it's been a lovely morning um with yourself, and it's been a lovely walk. We've had a we're blessed with the sunshine on our backs there for parts of it. So um I'd like to wish you all the best as a father and a and a business owner in the future, and hopefully we we'll uh continue to work together for more success.

SPEAKER_01 50:08

Definitely, John. Thank you very much. Thanks for having me on, and uh look forward to working together.

SPEAKER_00 50:13

Take care.

SPEAKER_01 50:14

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 50:17

Thank you for listening to this week's episode. The wisdom here doesn't come from me, it actually comes through me from the men like you that I walk alongside. And if the conversation today landed and you would rather live it rather than just listen to it, I want to invite you to the grounded man hike. It's a day in nature with a small group of founders and leaders, men who carry a lot and want to carry it lighter. And there's no slides, pitch or agenda, just honest conversation and open ground. The link is in the description below. Leave your details and I'll be back to you personally. Thanks for being here, and I'll see you next week.